Karpov on Fischer (1/3) | Chess News

Karpov on Fischer (1/3) | Chess News

Irwin Fisk: When did you first become aware of Bobby Fischer?

Anatoly Karpov: People started to talk about Fischer, but I was
living very far from Moscow at that time and we had no Internet, no TV,
so information was slow in coming. But, of course after the Candidates
Match everyone knew Fischer.

IWF: How old were you in 1971?

AK: I was 20 years old. I was already one of the strongest grandmasters.

IWF: Spassky was in preparation to play Fischer for the World Championship. Had you played Spassky?

AK: Yes, I played a training match with Spassky. He asked me to play
training games, but we played only one game. Spassky won this game even
though he had a lost position, but I made a stupid mistake, and after
this suddenly Spassky said he doesn’t want to continue this training
match, so maybe he was happy he beat me in that game.

IWF: Where was this game played?

AK: We were near Moscow.

IWF: Was it at a training facility?

AK: Spassky had a training session before he left for Reykjavik. He
had some problems in putting together his team and making last minute
preparations, so he wasn’t concentrating so much on chess. I stayed at
the training session two weeks, and almost every day Spassky was going
to Moscow and coming back. It was near Moscow, like 60 km from Moscow,
but he had to go to the city every day, so you can’t concentrate. We
were analyzing a lot. (Efim) Geller was there. Then, (Nikolai) Krogius
was there, then Iivo Nei, so that was his team. Reykjavik was soon, and I
was there, but the main piece (Spassky) was not there. Spassky only
came in the evenings, and as I said it was not very serious what he had
done.

IWF: Were you playing at a government facility?

AK: No, it was at a health

IWF: What do you think was going on with Spassky? Why wasn’t he coming to train?

AK: He was very self-confident and he had a positive score in his
previous games. He had played well against Fischer in previous games
before the match. Spassky, as I said, was quite sure he would beat
Fischer in spite of the impressive results Fischer showed in the
Candidates Matches. It is known that Spassky is not a big worker or hard
worker in chess. He is quite lazy, so he didn’t work too much on chess.
This was the main reason he was defeated by Fischer. If you recall the
games, it was game four when Spassky with black showed a fantastic
novelty which was prepared by him and his team. I know this novelty.
But, what happened is Spassky didn’t make the effort to memorize it,
because it was winning by force.



Geller told me when they started to repeat this before the game,
Spassky, after three or four moves into the novelty, said, “Oh, this is
not so important, because I will find the moves over the board.” So, he
didn’t remember the moves and he didn’t win the game, which had already
been won at home. This was extremely important because Spassky won the
first game, a strange game. Better not to say that Spassky won the game,
but that Fischer lost the game. Then, Fischer didn’t appear for the
second game, and Fischer won the third game, so if Spassky had won game
four with black, he most probably would have won the match. He just
didn’t play well after game four.



Both players had lost so much energy in the first eleven games that
they were like boxers in the last round. Tired. Spassky could have won
many games in the second part of the match, but he missed everything.
Then, Fischer won everything. It certainly brought chess to the
forefront.

IWF: Did you go to Reykjavik?

AK: No, I didn’t go to Reykjavik. This was a mistake by the sport
leaders of the Soviet Union, because it was considered that I should go,
not as a part of Spassky’s team but just to watch and understand the
championship match and to get experience. In an official document from
the (Soviet) Federation, one of the sports leaders in the Ministry of
Sport wrote that it was too early for Karpov to go, because they didn’t
see a great future for me for the world championship (laughter).



I watched the games (from Reykjavik). We were making preparations for
the World Chess Olympiad. I was there with (Tigran) Petrosian and
(Paul) Keres and (Viktor) Korchnoi and (Mikhail) Tal. I mostly analyzed
with Keres and Korchnoi.

IWF: Where was this?

AK: Near Moscow. I remember that summer because it was very hot and
there were fires all around Moscow. Fire of the turf (peat). You could
smell the smoke. We were in the city of Dubna. Dubna is famous for its
nuclear energy institute, and Dubna at that moment was one of the chess
centers. Many scientists played chess, so they liked chess players to
come there. So we stayed in the hotel in the middle of the city. We
analyzed together with Keres and Korchnoi most of the games that Spassky
played against Fischer. I found ways that Spassky could get a winning
position in the opening of the Alekhine Defence. Fischer played the
Alekhine Defence and Spassky missed a very big advantage.

IWF: Geller and Krogius went to Reykjavik, as I recall.

AK: It was the team of Spassky, Geller, Krogius and Livo Nei from
Estonia. We had our team, the Soviet Union team, which were preparing
for the Chess Olympiad.

IWF: What were the team members saying as the Spassky vs. Fischer moves were coming in?

AK: We could see it was a very big fight. Very emotional. Actually,
my friends on the team with whom I was working were impressed by one of
the adjournments where Fischer had the advantage, but after the
adjournment he played a very sharp line and he analyzed very deep
because it looked dangerous. But Fischer analyzed very deep and won the
game which had many complications. We were impressed by the quality of
his analysis of that game. Fischer showed many novelties in the opening,
so it was clear that Fischer had prepared very well.

IWF: I know Fischer was playing 1.e4 so much
before the match that there was a cartoon on the cover of Chess Life
that featured Spassky at the board, surrounded by the Soviet team. One
asks, “But Boris, what if he doesn’t play 1.e4?” Were they training for a
variety of openings or did they place more emphasis on e4?

AK: I wasn’t there for all of the training, but Fischer had to play 1.d4.

IWF: At what point did you and your team realize that Spassky was going to lose the match?

AK: Fischer took the lead very quickly after he lost the first games.
Spassky couldn’t show anything; he was playing very bad. It was already
clear that Fischer was playing better chess at that moment. Later,
nobody expected Fischer to lose.

After the strange incidents in the beginning of the match, Bobby Fischer quickly took control

IWF: When Spassky lost, there was a lot of talk that he wasn’t treated well.

AK: What do you mean he wasn’t treated well?

IWF: The Soviet authorities were unhappy that he lost; there was so much at stake.

AK: The Soviet authorities were very disappointed, and of course
chess players had deep (many) privileges within the society until that
moment. We started to come under attack years later, not immediately,
but at that time the prizes (money) were not taxed. Spassky received the
full prize (money) without paying any taxes, but then he began to
behave strangely. Probably this was a reaction for his defeat, and so he
didn’t feel psychologically well. He started to behave a little bit
arrogant. He just made the leaders disappointed and upset. They gave
full support to his preparation. They put some conditions which Spassky
didn’t like about forming his group. They insisted that he have security
as part of his team. Spassky didn’t want it. Spassky wasn’t happy. He
was not free to take everyone he wanted and he wanted not to take other
people. This, as I understand, was the only inconvenience.



These people thought Spassky should behave differently after losing
this important match. He had problems with his private life, which was
being criticized at that time. In the Soviet Union, the moral part of
life and the private life was to be under control, always. Spassky, from
their viewpoint, wasn’t behaving well. At the end, they (Soviet
authorities) attacked not only Spassky, but all of our advantages. In
1975, they created a law under which we gave part of our prizes (money),
a big part of our prizes, to the state.

IWF: Really?

AK: When I played my match with Korchnoi in 1978, I received only 20% of my prize.

IWF: 80% went to the state?

AK: Yes, Spassky received 100%.

IWF: So that hurt chess players from then on.

AK: Before Spassky lost to Fischer, and two years after, we didn’t
give any money (to the state) from our prizes. From exhibitions, yes,
but not from prizes. I was the biggest victim in 1978. We had good money
in the Philippines, but I had to give most of my prize to the state.

IWF: Did they call it a tax?

AK: No, actually it wasn’t a direct tax. We had to give it to the
Sports Ministry. They called it participation in developing sport and
chess in the country.

IWF: Didn’t Spassky move to France?

AK: Yes, he moved to France in ’75. This was described when the
leaders said, “This is enough. We gave chess players everything and they
didn’t behave well.”

resort.